HJ Dagger Ernst Pack & Söhne

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what do you think abaut this dagger made by Ernst Pack
I think it is a very early one and original i think

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Janjan,

this is not an early version but rather a transitional version. (production between 1936 - 1938). I come to this conclusion for the blade has a ricasso and the motto is present as is the makers logo. I have my doughts about the diamond inlay. Does it move? From the picture I get the impression it is fixed, but I can be wrong.
It has the desired pommel eagle form head wich was seen with some other makers indeed only on early knives. Furthermore it has the right rivets to keep the bakelite handles in place.
A definately to keep piece, would be glad to incorporate this one into my collection (if the inlay is ok).
wizardelf
:belgium
 
As wizardef says, this is a transitional knife, it has got a ricasso. I have the impression that the diamond is glued too, maybe I am wrong. The pommel eagle form head is very nice nad not often seen.
 
I respectfully dis-agree with the assessments above - this is not a transitional knife.

Janjan's assessment is correct in my opinion.

This is a very early knife from Pack, characterised by the different hilt, the 'spanner and nuts' instead of rivets, the plates, the eaglehead pommel, and the unique shape of the blade.

Making an assumption that all knives with a ricasso is a transitional, is not correct.

I believe this term is meant to mean a knife with a motto, a maker mark, and an RZM mark.

There are always exceptions to some of these guidelines.

This is nice example of an early piece.

Regards

Russ
 
It would be nice and helpfull for all blade HJ collectors to integrate these new terms and pictures in our Wiki guidelines. Waiting for an update. Thanks: Northwind
 
I'm hoping to do a little work on that sometime soon.

Regards

Russ
 
That would be great Russ. I've just transferred the information from your post to a new sub-section in the HJ knife page but it would be great if you could check the page as your time allows and see whether improvements are required.
 
I thought that all knives with a ricasso are transitional! One never stops learning... Thanks for the information, Russ.
 
Russ wrote about mounting of the grip plates: " the 'spanner and nuts' instead of rivets".

It is rather normal for this maker to do so on dress bayonets (have seen a lot of them), maybe it is normal on HJ-knifes too ?? - Pack is i.m.o. a rare maker of HJ-knifes, but maybe someone can confirm about the grip plate mounting on Pack's.


Se pic of my dres bayonet:


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Micheal :denmark
 

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Hi Michael, I believe Pack used the spanners and nuts in their very early HJ's, and I would think, their early bayonets as well.

As detailed earlier, they were distinctly different from other HJ's.

There are also many examples of Pack HJ's that we see in the "regular" form, with the 'normal' plates and rivets, and 'normal' hilts, including the 'no ricasso' variants and transitionals.

There is also a 1939 dated example with a motto, maker mark and RZM mark. In my mind, there is no doubt that it is an original piece, and, extremely rare.

I have images of these but they do not belong to me.

It is the largest collection of Pack knives that I've seen, and the condition of the knives in this collection is simply outstanding.

Hopefully, we may get to see some of them here.

Regards

Russ
 
Hi gents

Just following on from the last post, I've been in contact with the owner of the Pack collection and he has given me permission to post it here - many thanks!

Thanks janjan for getting this going by posting your great early example.

I will start a new thread on these in a couple of hours so as not to hijack this one.

Regards

Russ
 
I also got an other early Pack witeagle head but with an other MM.
just one gripplate is restaurated on spanner nutt was screawed to tight
I will post pictures when I find some time
 
Here some pictures of my other Ernst Pack knive
one gripplate is a little dammaged

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Another nice example here janjan.

I think this one is earlier than the previous one you have shown.

Regards

Russ
 
I thank you all for possitive replys
The knives are not as new but I`m happy to have them in my collection.
Perhaps some time I`ll find some gripplates to restore the knives.
 
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