Deutsches Jungvolk DJ Shooting badge M1/123

Hi,

A photo would be useful but seeing this MM on a shooting badge is a bad sign.

Not that anyone would fall for this one but it's an example of that MM in use on a bad badge:

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DJ fake?

Here are the pictures.

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Wim Vangossum has carried out some research into the HJ and DJ shooting badges and he is of the opinion that M1/123 is a fantasy MM and that any badge with it is a modern copy. M1/123 is a maker number that did not appear in the RZM lists. I believe that Huesken has attributed a name to M1/123 but who knows how he arrived at that conclusion. Jo Rivett may well be able to help out more here.
 
Yes, i agree with Wim, that until now, the only badges with M1/123 found on them, are all fakes. The same as a M1/129 for example. Although both surely did have a M1/ license.
So not really a fantasy mark, as the license was held and existed, but rather at this stage only a mark that is found on fakes.
The badge in post 3 is a clear fake to me.
 
So far as I understood, there is no sign of material fake. Only the lack of a registered RZM factory made your opinion. Why arent any other doubtless items high quality reproductions. Regards: NW
 
So far as I understood, there is no sign of material fake. Only the lack of a registered RZM factory made your opinion. Why arent any other doubtless items high quality reproductions. Regards: NW

Sorry mate, dont have a clue what you are on about? M1/123 is not an unknown maker, neither is M1/129, it is just that, until today, no small genuine enamel badges are known with their number.
No, the lack of a refernce to an "unknown" number is no reason to doubt, this i have written about and said many times, and can prove with genuine badges by RZM 33, M1/145 .. the list is long of numbers that we dont know who they belonged too, but they did, 100% produce small badges at a certain time. (With RZM 33 this "time" was the transitional period- after this, NO genuine badges are known with M1/33 because there never was such a number.

The same with M1/4, although every list you find contains M1/4, there was actually never such a number, they lost the RZM license "RZM 4" for small badges before there was a M1/ system.

I wont bother trying to discuss more with you about this badge, because the images are small, and it really doesnt make any difference what i say. It is fake for sure, 100%, but if you want to believe otherwise, why not?
many collectors are living in denial, and accept things that never were as genuine, i dont mind. Just sharing some info thats all, and really no desire at all to continue down this road, or with this maker.
 
Jo, thanks for detailed informations. I havent bought this DJ shooting badge. I was wondering about that low starting price. You could follow that auction on a finnish site. Have a nice day: NW
 
Here's another one that's on an auction site currently:

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There are no bargains in this world. At least not in TR collecting. 24 Euros for a genuine, DJ shooting badge in good condition? No way. Apart from what Jo said about the RZM number...
 
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