Let's talk about printed HJ armbands

Garry

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This is a thread dedicated to getting to bottom of whether the printed armband existed during the TR. It is part of our series on 'Annoying HJ collectibles'

Add your links to other discussions, evidence, pictures - anything that will help in building a compendium of information on these items for quick reference.

This post will act as the collecting point for information and it will be updated as information comes in from your posts below.

Please read this thread: Printed Armbands ... the Truth (Full Member Article) and this thread: Printed HJ armband - photograph
 
A recent post by Bob Coleman on the War Relics forum quotes Bill Shea as saying printed armbands are absoluley period items. I will post a link to the discussion later.
 
They are, i showed that here last year. Just that many fakes are printed too :-(
 
A recent post by Bob Coleman on the War Relics forum quotes Bill Shea as saying printed armbands are absoluley period items. I will post a link to the discussion later.


Could you post a link to that post please Darin?
 
Here is the link to a discussion on War Relics Forum.

Hitler Jugend forum at War relics forum

There is commentary from Bob Coleman where he quotes Bill Shea on the thread. Interestingly to me nowhere in the thread is it mentioned that anyone has period documentation or a catalog listing such as Jo has posted in his article on printed armbands. Many seem to associate them as "late war" items. The article by Jo shows this to be the opposite. A case of an opinion being mentioned by respected dealers and collectors that becomes "fact" later as we see over and over? So begs the question, Were the RZM regulations prohibiting printed armbands enacted to stop them from being worn, or to stop manufacturers from introducing them?
 
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Here is the link to a discussion on War Relics Forum.

Hitler Jugend forum at War relics forum

There is commentary from Bob Coleman where he quotes Bill Shea on the thread. Interestingly to me nowhere in the thread is it mentioned that anyone has period documentation or a catalog listing such as Jo has posted in his article on printed armbands. Many seem to associate them as "late war" items. The article by Jo shows this to be the opposite. A case of an opinion being mentioned that becomes "fact" later as we see over and over. So begs the question, Were the RZM regulations prohibiting printed armbands enacted to stop them from being worn, or to stop manufacturers from introducing them?
The catalog is older than 1933-4, just an updated older publication with a few new 1933 items added, as many makers did then, hence many pre 1933 items being found offered after 1934-5. Surly though this died out in Germany in 1935, BUT, these printed armbands, as mentioned, were the "cheap" version, so although after German standardization in 1933-1936, there were still other areas, Saarland, Austria and the Sudetenland, Böhmen und Möhren, Danzig, Luxembourg etc etc etc, areas that were subjected before annexation to NS-Propaganda, which would have certainly included cheap items, made quickly, by either local, or German, manufacturers for the moment, for the masses, so i dont think that Printed armbands ever "died out" or that we can say FROM THIS DATE on there were no more, but just to say that after German Standardization surely they were not allowed to be worn as the OFFICIAL armbands any more. I would image that even up until 1933, many printed armbands were being worn instead of the official armband by HJ and SA alike, these people were poor, and every Pfennig that could be saved, was! Just look at that HJ 1932 photo i uploaded a while ago, most of that stuff is not even cheap printed, its Home-Made.. that alone shows you how people would try and save every cent.

Late War? i dont agree with that at all, its the age old excuse for mass amounts of crap that turns up, a get-out-of-History clause to use as a quick Thumbs Up because of the war, and that materials were subject to rationing - after the war started, automatically attributing every POS item made in an inferior way to pre war items - is Boring, and old hat. I believe that surely the vast majority of printed armbands today are fake, Just look at ALL the House of Swords catalogs that span 20 years, they ALL show printed armbands .. so the post-war market has Purchased these in their thousands since 1945, yet where are they?? every single flipping printed armband today seems to get a good thumbs up, and a direct to 1944-1945... as a means by which to say its definitely good.

The reason why until recently nobody showed the printed catalogs showing "printed armbands" is not because i am a superhero, but because nobody is cared... they all would rather believe the end-of-war story and make up other tales instead of doing any research... i guess because the Grand-Daddies of Rock and roll, that most collectors have been waiting on hand and Foot, once started a rumor that they were 1944-1945 made bands, thats why they are printed, so here, take a few box loads every week from my contact, and in a decade or two you can ask 100 each, because they have become accepted as what they are not, late war armbands....
 
There is a pic what I bought recently with an early HJ member with printed armband

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Great picture ! supporting whats been suggested so far, that they are early and not late war.
 
Thanks Darin.

I've been banging on about these since 2006 and it was a period reference that initially got me thinking about why the RJF would prohibit something which didn't exist. My photo convinced me that the printed armbands were early items which were later banned and so my photo, Albrecht's photo, the regulation and Jo's catalogue prove absolutely in my opinion that we are talking here about an early item and that the term 'late-war' is once again nothing more than a euphemism for 'sorry, I'm just too lazy and/or too incompetent to look for the actual truth but would you please buy this anyway?'

Here's my printed armband:

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This is great information guys. The 'late war' excuse takes another hit :001_cool:
 
Here is another photo of an early member (note the buckle and cap) that appears to be wearing a printed armband. Another nail in the "late war" coffin?

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Here is another photo of an early member (note the buckle and cap) that appears to be wearing a printed armband. Another nail in the "late war" coffin?
Is that the 1933 Hindenburg/Hitler tinnie? As far as "another nail" is concerned, it`s not necessary mate, we have black and white proof that they were available before 1933, and we have black and white proof, from the RZM, that they were Forbidden shortly after.
 
Thanks Darin :thumb:

I'll add that one to the wiki article. Looks to be the same type of armband as is being worn by the chap in my photo.
 
Just thought about this old thread again.
Money was a HUGE issue around that time, Germany and Europe were slowly recovering from the worst Financial crisis ever known. So even though there was a so-called "Leichte ausführung" printed HJ armband, that cost 13 pfennig, as opposed to the regulatory armband that cost 23 pfennig, many kids were still making their own at this time.....

And about the late war issue, if any of the armbands shown on that thread came up today, i bet many of these "late-war Gurus" would say that they were from the very early years, and not from 1932-1933:sad:
Sometimes, especially when we have the facts, we just need to read them, and accept them, without adding our own "what if`s" or "could be`s" ... History is not always as complicated as we try and make out. (not we, but others, the Late-war others! lol)
 
Good thread. Certainly opened my eyes and you're right, all you ever hear on WAF and the other forums is 'late-war' assuming of course that someone even comments on them.
 
I just wanted to add that weren't stamps banned after a certain time? I have seen a few printed armbands with stamps on them so wouldn't this make them early too?
 
Here is another photo of an early member (note the buckle and cap) that appears to be wearing a printed armband. Another nail in the "late war" coffin?

awesome picture mate!!! of note is the non standard (if there is such a thing) hj shirt also, look at the points to the pockets and leather ''football'' buttons! again great period evidence picture!
 
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