RZM paper label colour conventions / regulations

Garry

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Does anyone have access to information on the conventions for the RZM paper labels attached to cloth insignia etc? I'm personally never sure whether the colours you see on these labels are correct for a given item and it would be good to get some pointers on what to look for in order to aid in the identification of a good, or indeed bad, item.
 
Hi Garry
Fishers reference vol 1 has an in depth section on the RZM but i cant find anything relating to the label colour,

There is reference to "Mitteilungsblatt der RZM " which appeared bi- weekly would this have been a magazine , it could be that the label colours were set out in that ,

cheers steve
 
Cheers Steve. Here's an example of what got me thinking:

first picture shows a DJ rune I just sold. It has the correct colour of label according to the RZM manufacturing instructions but the second picture shows another patch on sale with a red label. The same would appear to have applied to Gebiet triangles - a blue ink label was applied in 1936 but most of the triangles you see have a red ink label. The colours must have changed at some point but when? It would be really useful to see some info on this I think.

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The red label has a more polished apperance to it ,and has the NSDAP control logo in fishers ref it states that the state treasurer for the NSDAP issued a decree of operating regulations on 1 -6-1934 maybe thats when the labels changed,
Just a thought ,

steve
 
These are some comments from Wim regarding the paper tags on shoulder straps that shed a little light on the subject.

"By regulation the first tags had to be blue in color with TA and, as such, were used officially until spring 1935 when the TA was replaced by the A4 code, due to a re-organization. A tag with the "TA" officially should not have been used if the strap is post 1935, but one with "A4". It is possible the manufacturer still had old tags,but according to orders for the RZM inspections the old one was not allowed to be used in 1936."

Edit. This does not really address the color change, but I would speculate somewhere around 1936.
 
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Let's hope that Wims new book goes in depth on the RZM tags. He states that there will be a full list of manufacturers so hopefully he also addresses the timeframe of the tags and gives more information on the lettering.
 
Here's more information on the coloration of the tags from the Saris book.

"The colors for RZM tags as of August 4, 1934 were as follows:

Blue tag for HJ arm insignia, the stiff form of (Steifleinunterlage);HJ arm insignia "embriodered" (garnbestickt).

Black for HJ shoulder straps (in general).

From March 1938 the color of the tags for the HJ organisation in principle were to be red (blue was now reserved for SA and Political Leaders). These tags were to have a capital letter "A" which stood for the cheapest tag which cost about .5 pfening. The "A" was followed by the RZM symbol and "A4", the printed or stamped contractors number, and finally the HJ diamond."


Sources cited for the information include the 1935 issue of "Handbuch der Reichszeugmeisterei", and various issues of the RZM Mitteilungsblatt.

This appears to shed some light on the dating of the tags.
 
Seems that would be correct Paul. The large letter reflects the cost of the RZM tag itself not the specific item according to Saris, so the more expensive the tag the more expensive the item would be logically. The A is for the price of .5 pfening and it would go up in price as the letter changed according to his information.
 
THIS REALLY becomes evident with political collars and SS cuff titles which in fact normally had two tags one for the cuff and one for the quality of stitching or weave. The ones which are hand stitched always have the higher letter designation . This has become a great method of spotting fakes for instance when a collar shows up with a A tag and it is know this collar always has at least a c or D LETTER THERE IS A RED FLAG. Also back then 5 phennings had some value and IMO would buy a roll of tags then

paul
 
This is sort of a breakdown in the prices of the tags.

"the value for a single tag is indicated by the printed letter, for example
A = 1/2 Pfennig; B = 1 Pfennig; C = 2 pfennig; D = 3 Pfennig; E - 4 Pfennig; F = 5 Pfennig etc. (up through P for 50 Pfennig)."

This is the source he cites for the information.

In the RZM manufacturing-regulations page 17 from 1938 (section Ausrüstung) it was mentioned: red print is for HJ (blue for political leaders and SA).
Further it was said as:


It just makes sense that the more elaborate or expensive the item the higher the price of the tag would be to me.
 
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Along that line of thought here's a single DJ Strap without embellishments or anything I have with a "B" designation. Then there's a set of Gefolgschaftsführer straps that came with three pips from the factory with a "C" designation.
 
DOES not make sense Darin the tags themselves are all of the same quality and are massed produced the same way in runs of probably up to a million simply doing a type set change for the letter and resetting the counter . As with many thing there is a flaw in what as been put forward in the BOOK

paul
 
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