TABLE / PODIUM BANNER what could it be?

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HJ77

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Hi Guys,
Here is something I would like to share with you but have always wondered what exactly it is?
Is it a table / podium banner of some description and what exactly does the image mean?
From what I can tell , its basically a beautiful printed piece of what appears to be a Viking ship and with Oars below.
I would like to know if it relates to HJ and exactly what , perhaps Marine, I really don't know.
Would love to hear your thoughts.
Thank you
James
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To me it looks much like a local coat of arms. Unfortunately, I have not been able to find it.
The boat also looks Viking to me and might indicate something Nordic/Northern German.
Agriculture was apparently also of great importance, because the instruments underneath are two flails ;-).

But there is also the possibility that it could be a - bourgeois, not noble - family coat of arms.
 
Hi Jack,
Thanks for having a look at it.
I didn't think that to begin with but makes sense what you say. Good to know they are flails and perhaps a Nord connection with that Viking ship.
Im wondering if its Third Reich period based on the typical red , white and black look feeland not to mention the design of it and its construction.
Do you think this coat of arms looks likely for a district or town in Northern Germany recruiting DJ & HJ members?
Thank you,
James
 
Hi James,

Unfortunately, this is one of those points where you don't get very far in your research, unless chance helps.
I have found a few coats of arms with flails, but not the right one. And unfortunately I don't know of any online encyclopaedia of local coats of arms where you could search for them. Assuming it really is one, and not a family coat of arms.

The most I could do is check whether the digital version of Meyer's encyclopaedia also contains the coats of arms.
The print version has about 24,000 pages, I won't look through it ;-).

The colours have no political meaning, it could just as well be blue-yellow or green-white. Rather, regional aspects play a role (each German territorial state had its own traditional colours). And black-white-red has less to do with the Third Reich than with the colours of the Empire.
But I don't think your pennant is that old. It would be made of heavy silk, and the tassels of metal wire. If I had to guess, twenties to fifties.

To your last question: In every town, even in the smallest village, there was an HJ and DJ group in the TR.
 
Hi Jack,
I have been doing some research from this end based on what you said it being more a coat of arms and found one very close.
It's the WIEK coat of arms which has a beehive in the middle, close but not exactly what we are looking for and in difference with colours.
Looking at it closely , the tassel is more of a silk, and I have attached close ups of the weave in the body of the material used, including close ups of the metal components.
I still would love to know exactly what period it is and where / who used it.
Cheers
James

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Image as per previous post on WIEK coat of arms.

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Hello James,

I also found the Wiek coat of arms when searching. After that, I ruled it out straight away. And now comes the but, why it doesn't fit.
The German Wikipedia states, translated into English:
The coat of arms was approved by the Ministry of the Interior on 12 June 2001 and registered under No. 246 of the coat of arms roll of Mecklenburg-Vorpommern.

Blazoning: "Divided; above in red two diagonally crossed golden flails, the crossing covered by a golden beehive; below in gold a blue Viking boat with sail."

So the town has only had this coat of arms since 2001, and unfortunately I have found no evidence that they were allowed to use any other before then.

I'm sorry that I can't bring better news.
 
Hi Jack ,
All good from here , hoping some day I get a good understanding of what exactly it is that I have here, its a challenge.
Thank you
James.
 
Hi, as far as know this Tischwimpel indicates a farmers symbol . It shows 2 dresch schlegel, ( flail)a divice used to hit the top of the weat to split the fruit kernel from the holding grass stem. So for me this is a Tischwimpel used maybe in a gasthaus at the stammtisch, indicating who is meeting here. Just my thougt , Dirk
 
Bann 171 said:
Hi, as far as know this Tischwimpel indicates a farmers symbol . It shows 2 dresch schlegel, ( flail)a divice used to hit the top of the weat to split the fruit kernel from the holding grass stem. So for me this is a Tischwimpel used maybe in a gasthaus at the stammtisch, indicating who is meeting here. Just my thougt , Dirk
Click to expand...

Hello Dirk,
yes indeed, it is a probability.
Best Regards
Eric
 
It is simular to this trade zodiac
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Hi Dirk,

You mean a guild coat of arms?
I already said that they are flails. But that doesn't explain the boat, which probably refers to Vikings.

I know a little about heraldry.
There are local coats of arms with Viking boats, also a few with flails.
For me, everything points to North German or Scandinavian.
However, we have not yet found a directly matching coat of arms, even though the very recent coat of arms of Wiek on the island of Rügen shows some similarities.

So there still remains the possibility of a bourgeois family coat of arms, which also existed since the 14th century.
Quote from a coat of arms page: "Among the pictorial motifs, tools and implements from the various fields of activity and living space naturally dominate." There you go.
Unfortunately, this is all circumstantial evidence, and I fear that it will be very difficult to find a definitive answer here.
 
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