Jungenschaftswimpel

[Osvald21]

I have this pennant that I'm a little curious about. I assume it is a Jungenschaftswimpel, but according to the Organisationsbuch der NSDAP from 1936 they were black with a rune on both sides. As you can see from the pictures, this one is black on one side and blue and white on the other. Based on that, I'm guessing it's from Bavaria. The pennant measures 77 x 34 cm.

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[bertl59]

Well done, but I'm not sure if that's the "Bavarian Blue". I think Jack can find better info.

 

[Osvald21]

Well done, but I'm not sure if that's the "Bavarian Blue". I think Jack can find better info.

You are probably right about the blue color. Bavarian blue is lighter.

 

[Garry]

Nice one. One side of the Jungenschaftswimpel was permitted to have a design on it. This was the case in 1933 and I see it reconfirmed in a 1936 order published by HJ-Gebiet Sachsen.

 

[Jack]

Well done, but I'm not sure if that's the "Bavarian Blue". I think Jack can find better info.

Unfortunately, I can't help either. These are not the national colours of any German state or Prussian province that I know of. By the way, these flags were abolished in 1935.

The most likely thing here is that they are the colours of a city.

 

[Garry]

By the way, these flags were abolished in 1935.

Hi Jack,

The Jungenschaftswimpel is listed as an authorised pennant in the 1935 orders that standardised the youth flags and pennants. The HJ-Gebiet Sachsen order that I mentioned (Gebietsbefehl 10/36) is from the 5th of Nov 1936 and shows that they were still in use and that they could be purchased. Perhaps you mean the Jungzug pennant? They definitely were removed from the list of authorised items in 1935.

On the design of Osvald's pennant: this has the loops that you see on a Jungzug or Fähnlein pennant from 1933/4 whereas the 1935/6 version has three clips that attached to three eyelets on the carrying pole. The later type also has different dimensions. Osvald, would you mind measuring the length of the green lines on your pennant when you have some time please?

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[Jack]

Hi Garry,

I didn't mean the pennants, but the flags of the German states, provinces etc. These were all abolished in 1935.

 

[Garry]

Ah, sorry Jack. I see that now

 

[Osvald21]

Unfortunately, I can't help either. These are not the national colours of any German state or Prussian province that I know of. By the way, these flags were abolished in 1935.

The most likely thing here is that they are the colours of a city.

Thank you Jack.

 

[Osvald21]

Hi Jack,

The Jungenschaftswimpel is listed as an authorised pennant in the 1935 orders that standardised the youth flags and pennants. The HJ-Gebiet Sachsen order that I mentioned (Gebietsbefehl 10/36) is from the 5th of Nov 1936 and shows that they were still in use and that they could be purchased. Perhaps you mean the Jungzug pennant? They definitely were removed from the list of authorised items in 1935.

On the design of Osvald's pennant: this has the loops that you see on a Jungzug or Fähnlein pennant from 1933/4 whereas the 1935/6 version has three clips that attached to three eyelets on the carrying pole. The later type also has different dimensions. Osvald, would you mind measuring the length of the green lines on your pennant when you have some time please?

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Hi Gary,

The short side is 34 cm and the length 77 cm. The Siegrune is 24,5 cm.

 

[Garry]

Hi Gary,

The short side is 34 cm and the length 77 cm. The Siegrune is 24,5 cm.

Thanks It has the measurements of the early version (the 1936 version had a larger height 44cm). Looks to be a hybrid as it has the same loops as the Jungenschaft and Fähnlein pennants but I don't doubt that it's an original.

 

[Osvald21]

Thanks It has the measurements of the early version (the 1936 version had a larger height 44cm). Looks to be a hybrid as it has the same loops as the Jungenschaft and Fähnlein pennants but I don't doubt that it's an original.

Right, original it is. That´s unquestionable. But I don't understand what you mean by hybrid. And isn't it a Jungenschaftswimpel?

 

[Garry]

Right, original it is. That´s unquestionable. But I don't understand what you mean by hybrid. And isn't it a Jungenschaftswimpel?

Like I mentioned in post 6 above, it has characteristics of both the Jungenschaftswimpel and the next higher pennant (Jungzug and Fähnlein). Yours has roughly the dimensions of the early Jungenschaftswimpel but it has those three cloth loops that the early ones didn't have. The loops were seen on the Jungzugwimpel and Fähnleinwimpel at that time. Yours should just have two metal clips. The later version had three.

Here is the early Jungenschaftswimpel pictured in a 1933 publication along with the Jungzug and Fähnlein pennants. You can see that the latter have the cloth loops.:

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Here is an RZM Muster of the later Jungenschaftswimpel:

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[Osvald21]

Like I mentioned in post 6 above, it has characteristics of both the Jungenschaftswimpel and the next higher pennant (Jungzug and Fähnlein). Yours has roughly the dimensions of the early Jungenschaftswimpel but it has those three cloth loops that the early ones didn't have. The loops were seen on the Jungzugwimpel and Fähnleinwimpel at that time. Yours should just have two metal clips. The later version had three.

Here is the early Jungenschaftswimpel pictured in a 1933 publication along with the Jungzug and Fähnlein pennants. You can see that the latter have the cloth loops.:

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Here is an RZM Muster of the later Jungenschaftswimpel:

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Ok, thanks for the clarification.

 

[Strumble69]

One I was able to buy yesterday ! Very happy to add this one to the collection

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