Help! Orange piped HJ shoulderboards

[enthusiast]

Hello, Last week I was at the Ciney show and saw this HJ shirt with orange piped shoulder boards. Are they genuine, as I asked several well known dealers about them and all said they had never seen orange piped shoulder boards?? Any help or info would be appreciated. Thanks, Andreas.

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[Strumble69]

For me, its just red. Maybe this was the type of red they used, or from something like sun damage or overwashing.

 

[Garry]

Yes, can't be orange as that was of course never a colour used on these straps. I would give it a wide swerve. Look at the button they used for the strap

 

[lahntal]

here is another example

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[Pimpf359]

The shoulder boards shown above make a good impression, and the thread used to woven in the number is not the same as the piping. I also assume that the piping has faded from the sun. I've seen several boards like these and have some in my own collection.

The button is, of course, completely misplaced.

 

[enthusiast]

This colour is a kind of a funny one , I think I stay away of it .
Thanks for your comments.

 

[bertl59]

Indeed, sometimes you'll find shoulder straps with a color that's more orange than red. In most cases, this is due to the color fading over time; here are a few examples: on the left, the color tends towards yellow-orange! In the middle, a fairly dark red, and on the right, another faded red.

However, the numbers almost all have the same shade of red.

To get back to that pair of shoulder straps you presented, they are authentic but the quality of dye used by the manufacturer was poor.

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[enthusiast]

I understand helped by your examples presented. It wouldn't make sense to fake -like in this case -H.J. shoulderboards in a colour that didn't exist in the first place. That makes total sense. Thanks again , that cleared it up for me.
I do have another question for you , you may have an answer. I just bought a H.J. - D.J. Winterbluse ,D.J. Fliegerbluse which came without shoulderboards but loops for them. I would like to add one ( or even 2 ) D.J. shoulderboards because there are 2 loops and 2 buttons .So far I have only seen D.J. boards for sewing on and not for attaching by loops . Did they also come to be attached to loops ?
Here is the link to my Fliegerbluse post : HJ DJ Flieger HJ - Winterbluse | All other HJ DJ BDM and JM clothing items
Thank you
Andreas

 

[bertl59]

No, there isn't a DJ shoulder straps with loops. Regarding the jacket, it's just a hypothesis on my part, but I think it was reserved for/used by older HJ/DJ members (similarly, the trousers were authorized for 18-year-old members outside of the winter season, if I'm not mistaken), and this was from the moment the regulations mandated the wearing of HJ-style shoulder straps for senior DJs.

PS: Garry, if you could provide more details on the date of this change, as I can't find the reference anymore.Thank you

 

[enthusiast]

I had a closer look at the blouse and there are no marks indicating that there was ever a triangle or an armband attached to it. On the other side it looks like it had been worn , there a some big dark stain on the lower part and inside at the shoulders the material is frayed. What kind of shoulderboard (s) or insignia in general should I add to make it look complete in your opinion ? How about just H.J. Flieger shoulder boards , no triangle and no armband ?
A.

 

[bertl59]

There are no restrictions.
You can complete it with all the insignia common to HJ jackets and shirts: triangles, shoulder straps, and armband.

 

[enthusiast]

Die Sache ist dass ich schon 2 Winterblusen mit H.J. insignia habe und ich diese eigendlich mit D.J. Insignia vervollständigen wollte.

 

[Garry]

Just a quick one on the loops on the winter jacket: regulations state that on the earlier versions a loop had to be attached to the shoulder in order to attach the single DJ shoulder strap. On the later version with shortened collar, the jackets were delivered with loops on both the left and right shoulders as the jacket was the same for HJ and DJ. DJ members who wore only one strap had to remove the the redundant loop. This is hinting that there were DJ straps with the extra piece of material that was slipped under the loop but I've never seen any of those. A 1944 DJ pamphlet describes in detail how the post-1938 DJ straps with silver-grey stitching and braid were to be attached and the only permissible way to do this was to sew the outer end of the strap directly onto the cloth at the shoulder. The loops are not mentioned.

As far as HJ shoulder straps for the DJ is concerned, these were introduced in 1937 for DJ leaders authorised to wear the Führerdienstanzug.

In 1938 the DJ shoulder straps with silver-grey stiching and braid were introduced. Only Fähnleinführer and higher were permitted to have rank insignia on these new straps. Lower ranks had special rank patches that were worn on the sleeve. This was not always adhered to though as evidenced by two Gebiet orders from 1941 forbidding DJ leaders below the rank of Fähnleinführer from adding rank insignia to their shoulder straps.