Knife HJ - M7/2 1938 (Emil Voos), doubts of authenticity?

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DanPetary

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Dear forum members,
I am very grateful for your time.
I would like to show you a knife with the motto


The knife was purchased from a private collector with a 100% guarantee of authenticity and possibility of return.
The grip rivets are non-magnetic, the grip plates have very little backlash.

Best regards
Dan

more pictures

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Hello Dan, the rivets look roughly peened over on the backside, on the front side they look different shaped from each other and kind of set down deep into grips, IMO looks like grips & maybe diamond could have been swapped out, you say grips have some backlash? They should be tight with no play, cant tell from pic but the diamond checkering on grip plate should not follow the inset for HJ diamond, see what I mean here Error 404 | Lakesidetrader motto looks very dark almost like stamped on, maybe the pic tho., but you know they where acid etched onto blade, you should be able to feel motto etching with your fingernail run across it. Best Regards
 
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Thank you very much for your reply.
Before asking the question, I carefully read this article about knives on lakesidetrader.com.
The motto is indeed etched, it's just that the light and excellent blade condition makes it look very dark.


I understand that there should be no backlash, but other than that, any questions on authenticity?
best regards
Dan
 
zacker said:
..but the diamond checkering on grip plate should not follow the inset for HJ diamond, see what I mean here Error 404 | Lakesidetrader
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This has been demonstrated not to be true. Authentic knives with intact, unaltered grips do indeed have variation in the cut-out for the diamond. Incidentally, lakeside trader still sells the "DJ" knife so he doesn't own the gospel on knives although he is much better than most dealers on the standard HJ/DJ knife.
 
Go to war relics forum they have a full page of your knife to compare with, better yet post it there also, and German Daggers.com is worth joining also Herman there has vast knowledge of HJ knives seems more than anyone on the net, & his collection of them is awesome, if want the truth of what you have, seems right here is a fake with the bad grips M7/2 Emil Voos - Fake - Hitler Youth Militaria Collector Forum (hj-research.com) Best Regards
 
At warrelics is the knowledge.
I think this one has problems.
Crossgrain looks to rough.
And with a knife in this condition you would expect the white cloth at the runners inside the scabbard.
I know that the fakers also can laser an almost perfect motto.
Look online at the mint tagged Arthur Schuttelhofer knifes with bag. They are wrong! And high and dealers sell them as period.

I would pass on this one.

Stingray and Ger plus Mac at warrelics ar the more knowledgeable ones.
 
For example: This one is wrong! But it is etched
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Warrelics may be good on knives, I don't know but the level of general knowledge on HJ is just woeful over there. I checked out a few recent threads just now as I do regularly and the ansers to the majority are laughably inaccurate and concern stuff that was discussed here in depth years ago. Have they never heard of hj-research or something? Seems like a lot of people in the HJ "world" haven't..?
 
"Warrelics may be good on knifes"
Yes, she is.. and that's exactly what this thread is about!
And that's why "we" point to that forum in this particular case.

Knowledge in general on hj? This forum indeed.
But I learned one thing in 20 years of collecting. Know your sources (and use them).. and there are several.

Of course there are also questions asked on that forum which you think of "why" or.. "Google yourself "
But that is logical on a forum with a lot of collector and no specific collecting area.

But for the blades... go there..
They learned me a LOT.
 
I have one good knife and I bought it because it was obviously genuine. I don't need fifty knives or five hundred knives or indeed a DJ knife (liked by Hermann V by the way...). OCD is expensive and I have other hobbies.

"Knowledge in general on hj"? This forum is a hell of a lot more than that and it doesn't get the public respect it actually deserves imo.
 
I think this is the BEST forum on hj.
And with "knowledge in general" I could change in --> specialist knowlegde.
I did not meant to downgrade this forum by saying it is gerenal.. Not at all!
 
Each HJ forum has useful info, we are just trying to help the guy out, as for Herman likes so called DJ knife doubt it..

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zacker said:
Each HJ forum has useful info where just trying to help the guy out, as for Herman likes so called DJ knife doubt it..
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Hi Zacker, Okay but.... WAF HJ sub-forum is 99% a showcase for what people have i.e. no comment required and HJ on WRF is a tumbleweed infested wasteland where people say stuff that is usually at best 30% accurate and is all stuff that our forum did years ago but no one seems to have noticed. Hence the question "Have they never heard of hj-research or something?"

As far as Hermann V goes I'll try to find the quote from him where he does indeed support the DJ knife.
 
Okay crack but dont really care about the so called DJ knife, but wouldnt mind one for $20 for a deer gutting knife lo, I have had only 3 early HJ knives from around 12yrs ago bought each for only 3 to 4 hundred, cant pay retail price for one nowadays, be lucky to see same return on one, I only said Herman knows a lot about them & has a nice collection, so if we could keep to OPs topic would be of help, and yes I dont go much to WRF for HJ info as Saris is no longer there, a true shame.
 
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kriegsmodell said:
In my opinion the messer in the OP is not an original example. Far too many red flags, blade, trademark, pommel, motto, etc ..... It would not be for my collection.
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Thank you very much for your response.
I will add some more photos of both knives for comparison.

Best regards

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I see that M 7/2 turns out to be bad, well known reproduction, sorry but hopefully you get a refund, if not post his name or business every where.
 
Hello Gentlemen,

it's very difficult to give an objective opinion when you don't have the knife in your hands.

The grip rivets have been changed and this can be seen clearly on the reverse. Maybe the Grip plates were broken and replaced later, which would explain the non-genuine rivet grip.

The blade doesn't look good either due to the questionable Motto.

However, I remain puzzled when I read message of collectors on forums. There is no expert in the world who can claim with certainty whether an item is good or fake, let alone collectors.
I have been wrong in the past when giving my opinion on certain things, which is why I advise all of you to be cautious and vigilant.

Best Regards
Eric
 
kriegsmodell said:
In my opinion the messer in the OP is not an original example. Far too many red flags, blade, trademark, pommel, motto, etc ..... It would not be for my collection.
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is it bad trademark too?

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with all the other red flags on it & Hermann @ GDC says the tm looks amature applied, would be enough as you will find no one with more experience than him. Best Regards
 
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