Hitler Youth high leader gold buckle

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PatBateman

PatBateman

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Well this looks very nice indeed. Craig Gottlieb's site



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YA HE HAS SOME OF THE MOST OVER PRICED SHINED UP STUFF ON THE NET, he caters to the rich and now runs an auction house also once again for the very rich but still a nice shiny buckle
:bored:
 
So what's a more realistic price? I never contemplated buying anything because all the stuff there seems so expensive. But then this seemed like a rare item that perhaps could command a high price. When you say shined up do you mean he cleans the items to make them seem minty?
 
Hi Pat he has been caught shinning things up previously especially EKS to get the top prices . I would think this buckle would have to be complete with the brocade to demand anything near this price.
Others may have more input on value .

PAUL
 
HERE IS A LEADER BUCKLE on another sight that demands top dollar (DWG Mil)

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Pat I am not saying this buckle has been messed with but remember most mint unissued pieces still have the RZM tag attached in order to demand the word mint or unissued

PAUL
 
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This dealer is a favorite "whipping boy" on a lot of forums. He's in my area but I've never been to his shop or showroom or whatever he calls it. I would be careful dealing with him. No personal experience at all, but there's tons of stories about hyped up honor rings and daggers. Enough to scare me away. I do look at his site on occasion, lots of higher end stuff. I try to stick to just the people I've done deals with and items I am sure about.
 
Heres another HJ leader belt + buckle, RZM tags on belt and buckle. Collector Guild:

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Huge care is needed with the gold version as I'm sure many of you know. A well-known researcher (I'm not bigging myself up here - he told me this in private so I can't give his name) once told me that when he got his in 1975 only four were known in the world but that now '...every self-respecting HJ collector has one...'. Where did they all come from? Well, he said that the majority of those around today are (surprise surprise) either outright fakes from Hungary, Czech Republic and other eastern European countries or they are original silver leader buckles which were electro-plated after the war.
 
I'm with garry here. most people will not even give you comments on these buckles as they are such a minefield, have seen lots on waf with people asking if they are good and nobody answers because there are so many good fakes around
 
Hey Stu, check out the pull-down menus in the navbar below the forum banner here. All working in your browser now? :thumbup:

(You may need to ctrl-F5 to see the change)
 
Paul: Unless you have had an actual negative experience with my material or my customer service (in which case I expect you to contact me for an immediate resolution), I am frankly quite surprised to see a moderator of such a good forum repeating baseless "internet" rumor and innuendo. I have NOT as you claim been caught "shining things up" and there is nothing wrong, as you did state, with this belt buckle. Furthermore, if you know anything about Iron Crosses, you would know that "shining them up" is not something I really need to waste my time doing. Anyway, I hoipe your judgement and comments are not reflective of the quality of this forum, about which I have heard excellent things. You may not agree with the price of this artifact, but there is nothing physically wrong with it.
 
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Craig ... having an online business , you put yourself in the public eye . Be it that as it may , your website then is open to debate . You are new to this forum as of June 2011 . Please reframe from using sarcastic comments directed at members and or moderaters in open forum . If you have an issue with someone on this forum , it would behoove you to address your conserns via a personal message . As for Paul , being a long time collector (over 45 years) an ace debater and a combat veteran , I vouch for his integrity .
 
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I closed this thread a while back and asked that the matter be taken to PM. I've decided to reopen it because at the end of the day these buckles are controversial and instead of defending the buckle, the seller chose to defend himself which was an opportunity missed in my opinion. The fact remains that these are known to have been faked.
 
Garry said:
..... either outright fakes from Hungary, Czech Republic and other eastern European countries o...
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The Czech Fake-shifters Wesolowski and Czink spring to mind here, both friends of the seller mentioned above. Garry, look at Saris, born during the TR era in Germany, a collector, researcher and Author for longer than Gottlieb, Whammond and a few others have been alive (combined) and he gave up collecting Buckles because?.. because the fakes were so good that he was no longer 100% sure what was good or bad. And yet these, there is no other apt word for it, yuppy Pissnelken always have the brightest, mintest, unique-est stuff there is, and it`s 100% genuine of course. I wouldnt touch any of them, or their wares with a long stick.
 
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